PGA TOUR 2K21 on the XBox Series S?

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mebby

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« Reply #15 on: December 24, 2020, 11:38:34 AM »
Chiming in on an old thread...

I bought an Xbox Series S the other day.  I wanted the Series X but those are really difficult to find and patience is not my thing.  I read a little bit about the two consoles and decided that the S would be good enough and for most games I'm not sure I can tell a difference between true 4K and 1440 upscaled 4K.  HOWEVER, on PGA Tour 2K21 I can absolutely, 100% tell the difference.  It's almost night and day. 

A little background first (sorry for the longish post).  We just moved into a new house a few weeks ago which prompted me to add a TV so now I have two main rooms in which we watch TV (downstairs family room and upstairs family room).  I sold my old TV when we moved out of our last house and bought two new TVs for the two family rooms.  I put a 55" Sony 900H in the upstairs room and a 65" Sony 900H in the downstairs family room.  I've got the Series S running on the 55" Sony 900H and the Xbox One X on the 65" Sony 900H so I can pretty easily see the differences in the video quality between the two systems.

For games like Forza Horizon 4 I'm not sure I can really tell a difference.  But for PGA Tour 2K21 there are jaggies EVERYWHERE on the Series S.  It's most noticeable on the green grid lines.  On my One X the green grid lines are smooth as silk and on the Series S there are stair steps everywhere.

Additionally, the trees and grass textures on the One X are gorgeous whereas on the Series S they look a little garbled and fuzzy.  I may not have noticed it if I had never played the game on the One X before playing it on the Series S.

I kinda wish I had just waited to get the Xbox Series X.  I would've been happier but oh well.  I don't play enough games for it to really matter I suppose and I'm still super pleased with the One X on my bigger TV downstairs.
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jcauthen04

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« Reply #16 on: December 24, 2020, 12:49:57 PM »
Chiming in on an old thread...

I bought an Xbox Series S the other day.  I wanted the Series X but those are really difficult to find and patience is not my thing.  I read a little bit about the two consoles and decided that the S would be good enough and for most games I'm not sure I can tell a difference between true 4K and 1440 upscaled 4K.  HOWEVER, on PGA Tour 2K21 I can absolutely, 100% tell the difference.  It's almost night and day. 

A little background first (sorry for the longish post).  We just moved into a new house a few weeks ago which prompted me to add a TV so now I have two main rooms in which we watch TV (downstairs family room and upstairs family room).  I sold my old TV when we moved out of our last house and bought two new TVs for the two family rooms.  I put a 55" Sony 900H in the upstairs room and a 65" Sony 900H in the downstairs family room.  I've got the Series S running on the 55" Sony 900H and the Xbox One X on the 65" Sony 900H so I can pretty easily see the differences in the video quality between the two systems.

For games like Forza Horizon 4 I'm not sure I can really tell a difference.  But for PGA Tour 2K21 there are jaggies EVERYWHERE on the Series S.  It's most noticeable on the green grid lines.  On my One X the green grid lines are smooth as silk and on the Series S there are stair steps everywhere.

Additionally, the trees and grass textures on the One X are gorgeous whereas on the Series S they look a little garbled and fuzzy.  I may not have noticed it if I had never played the game on the One X before playing it on the Series S.

I kinda wish I had just waited to get the Xbox Series X.  I would've been happier but oh well.  I don't play enough games for it to really matter I suppose and I'm still super pleased with the One X on my bigger TV downstairs.

I'm glad you shared this report Mebby, I've been wondering about this game on the Series S.  I've asked in multiple forums, official and otherwise, but no one has been willing or able to answer the question about resolution as you just have.

I strongly suspect that what you're seeing on the Series S is pure 1080p, being upscaled to 1440p (by the Series X), and then upscaled again to 4K by your your TV.  If that's indeed what's happening, it's going to look like upscaled 1080p, which in my experience is a far cry from native 4K. 

PGA TOUR 2K21 is said to be "backward compatible" on the Series S and X.  The vanilla "backward compatible" classification means that it's not going to get any additional enhancement or optimization.  In the case of the Series S, that means it's going to emulate an XBox One S in backward compatibility mode.  Do you see any AUTO HDR at work on the S version?  It makes a noticeable difference on the Series X, IMO.

Even though PGA TOUR 2K21 looks a little better on the Series X, and the controller inputs feel less laggy, that 30 FPS frame rate cap still has its foot on the throat of this game. Even on a powerhouse like the Series X, being throttled by that cap just takes the life out of it for me, having grown accustomed to playing it at 60 FPS on the PC.
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mebby

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« Reply #17 on: December 24, 2020, 05:06:14 PM »
The stick input is also less laggy in the Series S. The game is a joy to play on both consoles but I do prefer the One X simply due to the better graphics.

I think you’re right about the 1080 to 1440 to 4K. The game suffers quite a bit graphically on the S compared to the One X.

But seeing as how the Series S isn’t my main machine it’s more than fine. I’ll eventually replace the One X with the Series X.
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jcauthen04

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« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2020, 11:06:09 PM »
The stick input is also less laggy in the Series S. The game is a joy to play on both consoles but I do prefer the One X simply due to the better graphics.

I think you’re right about the 1080 to 1440 to 4K. The game suffers quite a bit graphically on the S compared to the One X.

But seeing as how the Series S isn’t my main machine it’s more than fine. I’ll eventually replace the One X with the Series X.

I bet the next PGA TOUR 2K21 will have a native 1440p mode for the Series S.  Another thing to remember is this, the One X version of 2K21 not only renders at 4K, it has higher detailed course objects than the XBox One S.  You're missing out on that also.

I'd be curious to see just what the Series S would do with PGA TOUR 2K21 with an unlocked vsync myself.  I'd be surprised if it couldn't render 1080p at 60 FPS, and I think that would help you to overlook a heap of problems you might otherwise have with it graphically! 8)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2021, 12:51:34 PM by jcauthen04 »
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mebby

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« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2021, 10:55:28 AM »
The stick input is also less laggy in the Series S. The game is a joy to play on both consoles but I do prefer the One X simply due to the better graphics.

I think you’re right about the 1080 to 1440 to 4K. The game suffers quite a bit graphically on the S compared to the One X.

But seeing as how the Series S isn’t my main machine it’s more than fine. I’ll eventually replace the One X with the Series X.

I bet the next PGA TOUR 2K21 will have a native 1440p mode for the Series S.  Another thing to remember is this, the One X version of 2K21 not only renders at 4K, it has higher detailed course objects than the XBox One S.  You're missing out on that also.

I'd be curious to see just what the Series X would do with PGA TOUR 2K21 with an unlocked vsync myself.  I'd be surprised if it couldn't render 1080p at 60 FPS, and I think that would help you to overlook a heap of problems you might otherwise have with it graphically! 8)

That makes sense JC.  The trees in PGA Tour 2K21 on the Series S are blotchy and downright ugly.  I only play the game on my XB1X at this point.  If I'd never seen the beauty of the game on the XB1X I probably wouldn't notice how badly the Series S looks but now that I know I can't unsee it.
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jcauthen04

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« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2021, 12:50:24 PM »
The stick input is also less laggy in the Series S. The game is a joy to play on both consoles but I do prefer the One X simply due to the better graphics.

I think you’re right about the 1080 to 1440 to 4K. The game suffers quite a bit graphically on the S compared to the One X.

But seeing as how the Series S isn’t my main machine it’s more than fine. I’ll eventually replace the One X with the Series X.

I bet the next PGA TOUR 2K21 will have a native 1440p mode for the Series S.  Another thing to remember is this, the One X version of 2K21 not only renders at 4K, it has higher detailed course objects than the XBox One S.  You're missing out on that also.

I'd be curious to see just what the Series S would do with PGA TOUR 2K21 with an unlocked vsync myself.  I'd be surprised if it couldn't render 1080p at 60 FPS, and I think that would help you to overlook a heap of problems you might otherwise have with it graphically! 8)

That makes sense JC.  The trees in PGA Tour 2K21 on the Series S are blotchy and downright ugly.  I only play the game on my XB1X at this point.  If I'd never seen the beauty of the game on the XB1X I probably wouldn't notice how badly the Series S looks but now that I know I can't unsee it.

Since PGA TOUR 2K21 is only classified as "backward compatible" on the Series S and X, it's not going to reap the benefit of the natively rendered 1440p output it would be getting if its was Series S enhanced.  The Series S is said to run XBox One backward compatible games as if it was an XBox One X.  That would mean 1080p in this case.

I'm amazed at the difference I see on my PC when going from 4K (2160p) to 1440p in PGA TOUR 2K21, as I'm required to do to maintain 60 FPS on some courses.  1440p still looks a sight better than 1080p, but the jump from 1440p to 2160p in this game is even more striking.

Oh, please note that I changed "Series X" to "Series S" in the last paragraph of my included original quote above.  I was trying to say that I'd be willing to bet money that the Series S could run PGA TOUR 2K21 at 60 FPS in 1080p, not the Series X.  I know it could run it at 60 FPS in 2160p without batting an eye!

You've seen what 2160p looks like in this game compared to 1080p, so I know that would be a difficult sacrifice to accept for 60 FPS.  It would be one I'm sure many would like to experiment though.
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ISAWTHAT

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« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2021, 07:32:26 PM »
I have yet to purchase this game, just curious on this 60 frames update and what it looks and plays like on the series S.  I have an Acer 1440p 144 megahertz monitor should look and play pretty smooth.

The monitor has free sync HDR
« Last Edit: March 06, 2021, 07:35:21 PM by ISAWTHAT »
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jcauthen04

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« Reply #22 on: March 07, 2021, 12:00:31 AM »
I have yet to purchase this game, just curious on this 60 frames update and what it looks and plays like on the series S.  I have an Acer 1440p 144 megahertz monitor should look and play pretty smooth.

The monitor has free sync HDR

It seems like I read that the Series X renders 2K21 at 1440p.  I'm guessing it probably can maintain 60 FPS at that res, or reasonably close, with the vsync set to 60 Hz.  I'm sure your monitor will be up to the task for this game, but it will be getting a 60 Hz refresh rate with the game locked at 60.  I'll be interested in reading your reaction to it if you do buy it.  I haven't read an opinion on the 60 Hz vsync update from a Series S owner yet that I recall.
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Martbloke

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« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2021, 06:25:41 PM »
Just got a Series S as part of a package deal for a brand new 4K LG C14LB TV. Set it up to play on my old HD TV that my One X was on  for comparison and my god! This game on the Series S absolutely sucks in comparison to the One X. What is up with the trees and graphical glitches?? This is supposed to be an upgraded system right? Shocking. Will keep my 2K21 play time to my One X which is now on the gorgeous 4K TV.

Edit: OK so what I have now done is disable Game Mode on my HDTV and have it on 60hz to get rid of some of that huge lag and does look better. Still not quite as good as the One X on the same TV but playable.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 06:38:19 PM by Martbloke »

jcauthen04

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« Reply #24 on: July 30, 2021, 12:16:48 PM »
Just got a Series S as part of a package deal for a brand new 4K LG C14LB TV. Set it up to play on my old HD TV that my One X was on  for comparison and my god! This game on the Series S absolutely sucks in comparison to the One X. What is up with the trees and graphical glitches?? This is supposed to be an upgraded system right? Shocking. Will keep my 2K21 play time to my One X which is now on the gorgeous 4K TV.

Edit: OK so what I have now done is disable Game Mode on my HDTV and have it on 60hz to get rid of some of that huge lag and does look better. Still not quite as good as the One X on the same TV but playable.

I don't have access to a Series S, but from what I understand, it natively renders the game at 1440p.  I don't know if your TV has an option to be set to 1440p, but if it does, that might help to set the res to 1440p.  I'm curios... does the Series S have a graphics option to set the display resolution to 1440p?

So you were getting lag with your TV in "Game" mode?  I get lag when mine is not in Game mode on my TCL Series 6.  You do have your vsync set to 60 Hz in the PGA TOUR 2K21 graphics settings, right? 

I would try connecting the Series S to your LG C14LB, and setting its display res to 1440p @ 60Hz (it's not native, but I understand you can force it with this set) with the Series S display res set to 1440p.  Your report about adverse performance of the Series S with PGA TOUR 2K21 is the first I've read about.
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Martbloke

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« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2021, 12:55:38 PM »
Just got a Series S as part of a package deal for a brand new 4K LG C14LB TV. Set it up to play on my old HD TV that my One X was on  for comparison and my god! This game on the Series S absolutely sucks in comparison to the One X. What is up with the trees and graphical glitches?? This is supposed to be an upgraded system right? Shocking. Will keep my 2K21 play time to my One X which is now on the gorgeous 4K TV.

Edit: OK so what I have now done is disable Game Mode on my HDTV and have it on 60hz to get rid of some of that huge lag and does look better. Still not quite as good as the One X on the same TV but playable.

I don't have access to a Series S, but from what I understand, it natively renders the game at 1440p.  I don't know if your TV has an option to be set to 1440p, but if it does, that might help to set the res to 1440p.  I'm curios... does the Series S have a graphics option to set the display resolution to 1440p?

So you were getting lag with your TV in "Game" mode?  I get lag when mine is not in Game mode on my TCL Series 6.  You do have your vsync set to 60 Hz in the PGA TOUR 2K21 graphics settings, right? 

I would try connecting the Series S to your LG C14LB, and setting its display res to 1440p @ 60Hz (it's not native, but I understand you can force it with this set) with the Series S display res set to 1440p.  Your report about adverse performance of the Series S with PGA TOUR 2K21 is the first I've read about.


No option for 1440p but that's because of the TV, only 1080.

Yep so even on Game Mode, on 30hz there is always a small lag even with the Xbox One X. Setting it to 60hz, does eliminate the lag and the swing then feels 1:1 with my input but the swing is so, so sensitive to my input that it seems the swing is way too fast although I find that I can hot perfect tempos for days on that. I like the challenge of 30hz where I do get all outcomes from the swing which I should add, is not because it's more random, as I do get fasts when I swing fast and slows when swinging slow, but because of the lag it makes it harder to hit good tempo. It's clear this is likely to be big reason for a lot of people's frustration with tempo. What I also dislike about 60hz is that it performs the downswing as soon as I do and for putting, this feels incredibly weird - but that's likely a getting used to it problem. I can't play 60hz on the Xbox One X anyways as the fan goes hyper and I worry for it's life so I stick to 30hz.

My frustration is that I know the TV is not capable of the Series S performance to be better graphically than what it is with the One X hooked up, but it should be on par with the One X and it is not; it is worse on that same HD TV with the graphic setting set at 1080 and Game Mode on. That's what baffles me. Why is that? To make it look better, I have had to disable Game Mode which increases the lag massively on 30hz to be unplayable, and then put it to 60hz which improves the lag issue so it is playable and I hit perfects for fun, which is OK but will need to up to Legend I think haha. Even then it's still not as good as the One X on Game Mode. I guess I will have to play with the picture settings to dial it in a bit as I was so used to playing on Game Mode on the One X, and see how I get on.

The C1 is our main TV and as the Series S has no disc drive, I was just hoping to keep that upstairs for every now and then playing when I cannot use the lounge. I play a lot of other games that require discs when I have good time to myself in the lounge so I wanted to keep the One X on the C1. I may try switching them and see how I get on perhaps.

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« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2021, 04:26:03 PM »
Just got a Series S as part of a package deal for a brand new 4K LG C14LB TV. Set it up to play on my old HD TV that my One X was on  for comparison and my god! This game on the Series S absolutely sucks in comparison to the One X. What is up with the trees and graphical glitches?? This is supposed to be an upgraded system right? Shocking. Will keep my 2K21 play time to my One X which is now on the gorgeous 4K TV.

Edit: OK so what I have now done is disable Game Mode on my HDTV and have it on 60hz to get rid of some of that huge lag and does look better. Still not quite as good as the One X on the same TV but playable.
The PS4 Pro has horrible shimmering and everything looks flat colour wise compared to PC on my monitor. Yes an upscaled 1600p image to a 4K looks way worse than a 3440 x 1440 21:9 image which is actually lower res. I don't think the PS5 has any upgrade at all like the Series X has.
Look forward to trying the auto HDR on my 4K TV that Xbox has as it is coming to Windows 11

hammers1man

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« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2021, 04:36:19 PM »
Just got a Series S as part of a package deal for a brand new 4K LG C14LB TV. Set it up to play on my old HD TV that my One X was on  for comparison and my god! This game on the Series S absolutely sucks in comparison to the One X. What is up with the trees and graphical glitches?? This is supposed to be an upgraded system right? Shocking. Will keep my 2K21 play time to my One X which is now on the gorgeous 4K TV.

Edit: OK so what I have now done is disable Game Mode on my HDTV and have it on 60hz to get rid of some of that huge lag and does look better. Still not quite as good as the One X on the same TV but playable.

I don't have access to a Series S, but from what I understand, it natively renders the game at 1440p.  I don't know if your TV has an option to be set to 1440p, but if it does, that might help to set the res to 1440p.  I'm curios... does the Series S have a graphics option to set the display resolution to 1440p?

So you were getting lag with your TV in "Game" mode?  I get lag when mine is not in Game mode on my TCL Series 6.  You do have your vsync set to 60 Hz in the PGA TOUR 2K21 graphics settings, right? 

I would try connecting the Series S to your LG C14LB, and setting its display res to 1440p @ 60Hz (it's not native, but I understand you can force it with this set) with the Series S display res set to 1440p.  Your report about adverse performance of the Series S with PGA TOUR 2K21 is the first I've read about.


No option for 1440p but that's because of the TV, only 1080.

Yep so even on Game Mode, on 30hz there is always a small lag even with the Xbox One X. Setting it to 60hz, does eliminate the lag and the swing then feels 1:1 with my input but the swing is so, so sensitive to my input that it seems the swing is way too fast although I find that I can hot perfect tempos for days on that. I like the challenge of 30hz where I do get all outcomes from the swing which I should add, is not because it's more random, as I do get fasts when I swing fast and slows when swinging slow, but because of the lag it makes it harder to hit good tempo. It's clear this is likely to be big reason for a lot of people's frustration with tempo. What I also dislike about 60hz is that it performs the downswing as soon as I do and for putting, this feels incredibly weird - but that's likely a getting used to it problem. I can't play 60hz on the Xbox One X anyways as the fan goes hyper and I worry for it's life so I stick to 30hz.

My frustration is that I know the TV is not capable of the Series S performance to be better graphically than what it is with the One X hooked up, but it should be on par with the One X and it is not; it is worse on that same HD TV with the graphic setting set at 1080 and Game Mode on. That's what baffles me. Why is that? To make it look better, I have had to disable Game Mode which increases the lag massively on 30hz to be unplayable, and then put it to 60hz which improves the lag issue so it is playable and I hit perfects for fun, which is OK but will need to up to Legend I think haha. Even then it's still not as good as the One X on Game Mode. I guess I will have to play with the picture settings to dial it in a bit as I was so used to playing on Game Mode on the One X, and see how I get on.

The C1 is our main TV and as the Series S has no disc drive, I was just hoping to keep that upstairs for every now and then playing when I cannot use the lounge. I play a lot of other games that require discs when I have good time to myself in the lounge so I wanted to keep the One X on the C1. I may try switching them and see how I get on perhaps.
Games will look better with game mode off because the TV uses it's post processing to refine the picture quality which creates input lag because it's post processing. Also the lower the framerate the more input lag, vsync not hitting 60 fps or even hitting 60fps more input lag.
A game like this that relies on precise timing will always really benefit from the highest framerates and VRR. It is why a lot of e sports are played on super high refresh monitors at 1080p.

jcauthen04

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« Reply #28 on: August 03, 2021, 01:15:09 AM »
No option for 1440p but that's because of the TV, only 1080.

Yeah, that's going to limit your options a bit. Since the Series S is built to render natively in 1440p, I have to wonder if it demonstrates performance anomalies downscaling from 1440 to 1080p?  I've read that this at least results in blurring in some cases. 

I'll respond to your other comments here in a bit

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hammers1man

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« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2021, 03:55:22 PM »
No option for 1440p but that's because of the TV, only 1080.

Yeah, that's going to limit your options a bit. Since the Series S is built to render natively in 1440p, I have to wonder if it demonstrates performance anomalies downscaling from 1440 to 1080p?  I've read that this at least results in blurring in some cases. 

I'll respond to your other comments here in a bit
Shoundn't 1440p on a 1080p TV just be like a slight supersampled image?, so slightly better image than 1080p native.
On the other side upscaling 1080p to my 4k TV works great, but 1080p to 1440p monitor is horrible, the upscaling doesn't work well on those 2 resolutions.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 03:56:59 PM by hammers1man »

 

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